Marzocchi Shiver 45 help?
 

Firstly, is there an easy way to get at the gubbins to revalve these forks, or is it full disassembly? Is there a guide anywhere to do this? I'm quite a confident mechanic but this is something I've never touched before.

Ok, long story short.

Tried thick oil, tried thin oil, tried 4.5 4.8 5.0 springs, mixtures of each with varying preload 0 to 10mm. Fitted new bushes, turned clickers to the extremes, torqued the lower triple clamp bolts to 5Nm, had Dr Shox revalve / service etc...

I cannot make these forks feel the way I want them to feel. They have always felt harsh over square edged bumps (too much high speed compression... Maybe) and too soft when riding fast through loamy shit, the forks like to jack knife (too little low speed compression... Maybe)...

So is there a way i can get into the guts of these without completely disassembling the fork, can I just undo the bottom bolt with the compression adjuster and hallelujah? Dr Shox did a mod so I have some actual control about the rebound settings, but the compression still feels way off...

Call or email Drew Smith at Works Enduro Rider. He is the Guru on these forks. He did mine on my 2011 gasser when I bought it new. He absolutely solved all issues, like a different set of forks. Also, ask him about a set of SKF seals. Drew installed these on mine and they have less stiction and won't leak.

Here is the contact link,

https://www.werproducts.net/contact..html

What he said. Drew at WER did my 45 Zokes. The way he explained it to me was that those forks have no mid-valve. When Works does them, they add their own mid-valves. Whatever he did made them work a treat for hare scrambles. Just a few clicks either way for conditions and I have no complaints.

Obviously you don't want to ship forks from the UK, but I have always found Drew willing to talk, so you might get some insight from him.

I'm more than happy to have a go myself, just wanted a little guidance getting them apart mostly.

Is it possible to just turn the forks up side down and remove the compression valve without disassembling the rest of the fork? Also, do these forks have any mid valving or is everything compression covered in the bottom valve?

I've been searching for the answers to these questions all day and I'm starting to feel like my only option is to just try and find out ..

I can describe my forks in the same way. A few years ago I sent them to LTR, got some improvement but still not that great as I found out after having a second bike to compare with.

Planning a bike rebuild soon and hoping to address these issues. Like you not sure where to start.

Heck can we even get wear parts for these forks anymore?

Many bikes used these forks, gasgas, KTM, husqvarna, aprilia, beta etc... So parts are still quite easy to get a hold of.

I haven't tested mine yet, I've tried going mega soft so now I'm going from;

(Dr Shox recommended, with his valving)

Front
0.5 springs, 2mm preload
5w (23cst) @ 100mm
Comp 20 out
Rebound 6 out

Rear
5.7,
30/105 sag
Comp 15
HS Comp 2 turns
Rebound 18

To;

Front
0.5 springs, 7mm preload
7.5w (33cst... Atf, ehem) @ 100mm
Comp 6 out
Rebound 6 out

Rear
5.7,
30/105 sag
Comp 2
HS Comp 1.5 turns
Rebound 10

I'm 95kg nekkid and 6' tall.

I know this is a drastic change, but I have done a hell of a lot of playing with the clickers and constantly feel like I'm chasing myself. The main thing I've noted is even my friends 04 yz250 feels much stiffer damping wise than mine with standard springs. This set up feels as similar to his as I can get, and the front and rear feel pretty equal (where the front always felt like it was 10x softer). When Dr Shox did the valving the main difference was the fork rebound clicker actually did something, I'll be interested when I do take it all apart to see what changed on the compression side...

Haven't ridden it yet, hopefully out this weekend and will report back.

You can indeed turn the fork upside down, use a 6 point socket with the lead in/taper ground flat for a solid fit between the very soft aluminium BV.

When people say no mid valve, technically the valve is there, but the valving has been setup to work as a check valve with a large float and very stiff stack. Ie it simply blows open. On the opposite stroke the rebound stack does the work.

The base valve controls the flow of the oil displaced by the damping rod as it enters the cartridge only, so obviously adding a mid valve stack that then slows the rate at which the piston can move within the cartridge adds significantly. It flows much more oil for any given displacement and as such has a more profound influence.

Opening the cartridge to get to the mid piston takes a bit more work, and some tooling. Nothing you won't be able to handle. If they haven't been opened before heat helps too.

So imo, you have two choices. You can remain in the dark about the mid valve setup and try to tune the base valve to obtain the result you want. Quick and crude, and leaves some to be desired. Or you can take the time to pull down what you have, try and get some feedback on where to go and make some changes.

The problem you have does sound like a check valve mid though, as it offers little damping support. Leaves the spring and base valve to control everything, which can cause exactly what you describe where they are soft and feel a bit willowish on small chop, yet can't flow enough to take the harshness out of the sharp hits. Often too little damping can also feel harsh as the fork dives deep into the stroke.

What extra tooling / steps are required to get at the rebound / mid valve? I've read the shiver manual about 10 times now and it still looks like it all just falls out once the base valve is out...

Hi Jake! The quote above describes exactly the problem I had with my 2011 EC 300 forks before Drew fixed them. I also had a lot of deflection.

I'm out today with my stiffer / more preload setup. If I'm not happy I'll rip into these forks and force them to work :p