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Enduro Engine 4 stroke (including EFI & Exhaust) 4 stroke engine, EFI, and exhaust discussion


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  #1  
Old 05-17-2011, 02:34 AM
BigChina BigChina is offline
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Default Help! 07 450 won't stay running!

Hello GG riders! I am new on here and am in desperate need of some help.
I have read through all the forums and nothing seems to quite match my problem.
I have an 07 450 FSR. It died on me right in the middle of a ride!
Basically i can start the bike, but without any throttle it will die after about 4 or 5 seconds. If you apply any throttle at all just dies too. You can start it with half or WOT and the bike will stay running at high rpm, but as soon as you let the throttle go it dies.
-I have checked the relays as suggested in differnt threads to make sure its not the fuel.
-I have checked the injector and its clean.
-Gas is fresh, and gas cap is vented.
-The battery is 12.5 volts, and when cranking is reading 10,3 volts, so i believe that is good.
-I havent checked any of the sensors cause i don't really know where they are....can some help with that? i understand there are 5???
-i checked the spark plug and it looks normal too.

I think its either a bad sensor (or bad wiring), or the ECU.

Thoughts??? any suggestions would be appreciated.
I have contacted our Canadian distributor and he has no clue. Awesome.

Thanks!


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Old 05-17-2011, 02:46 AM
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bergerhag bergerhag is offline
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Hi. Never seen that fault behaviour. Best is to get it connected to diagnostic software (technoresearch VDST).
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Old 05-17-2011, 11:40 AM
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Qui-gon Qui-gon is offline
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As bergerhag says the only real way is to use the diagnostic software and get the codes from it if there are any.
There are actually 4 sensors and a pick up pulser which starts the ecu sequence off when you rotate the engine. The sensors are: air temp (inside the airbox), water temp (right side rear cylinder head) and the throttle position sensor (side of the throttle body). The forth sensor is inside the ecu and measures atmospheric pressure.
A good starting point without the software would be to check out all the connectors associated with these sensors and the plug on the bottom of the ecu. You could also check out the tps for movement and make sure it is connected to the throttle butterfly. If it was stuck open it may cause the symptoms you have. The resistance measurements for the tps are A to B 550 ohms, and A to C or B should swing from 0 to 550 ohms as you turn the sensor.

Hope that helps
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Old 05-17-2011, 06:25 PM
BigChina BigChina is offline
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Thanks for the response guys! I really appreciate it.
Unfortunately there is no one in the area...that has any experience with diagnostic software. Yes...I live out in the country side.

I will be checking all the wiring and plugs for the sensors this weekend, thanks for the locations Qui-gon! that helps alot!! Can you explain a bit about how to check the resistance on the TPS?

much appreciated!

Will keep you posted!

Lost in Northern Canada!

Last edited by BigChina; 05-17-2011 at 07:10 PM.
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Old 05-18-2011, 12:04 AM
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bergerhag bergerhag is offline
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Download the 2005 fse user manual, it has a good wiring schematic with a ecu connector pinout. Then remove the tank and disconnect the ecu, you will then have access to the sensors for measuring resistance through the ecu harness connector. While you have tank off, inspect the connector on the ecu for broken pins. Now is a matter of looking for the sensor on the schematic, following the lead to ecu, and checking which pin number it connects to. Get your multimeter out!
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Old 05-19-2011, 06:53 PM
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Qui-gon Qui-gon is offline
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Here are what I believe to be the data sheets for the sensors and injector used on the Magneti Marelli EFI systems. The water air and injector data sheets match, the tps sensor is a car one used on the same family of ECUs so I think the physical size is the only difference. I have hosted them on my own website for now. I have no idea if this is copyright infringement so if it is perhaps one of the mods can delete the links. If it is ok then maybe our webmaster would host them here?

Water temperature sensor

Air temperature sensor

Throttle position sensor

Fuel injector

Hope this helps
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  #7  
Old 05-19-2011, 11:22 PM
BigChina BigChina is offline
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wow...that is some fantastic info you have on the sensors....i will be adding that to my archives!!! Thanks so much!

As far as my problem goes...well....coincidently there is another guy in my small northern town that happens to have the twin of my bike...what are the chances of that???? so he was gracious enough to just hand the whole bike over to me to start swapping parts to find the problem. The first part i swapped out was the ECU....sigh....it started first crank and runs fine. Dam it. So just to double check, i put my ECU back in....won't stay running. Dam it. so just to humour myself...i put his back in my bike...starts first crank. Dam it.

so now i have placed a call to the Canadian distributor.....he has to air ship one in from spain.....retail price...$780cdn. But hes going to give it to me for cost which is still $600.

Thankyou guys so much for your suggestions!! Unfortunately I am fully expecting one of the sensors to go sometime in the future...so I will be looking for this thread again.

If you have any suggestions on replacing the ECU please let me know as I will be placing the order early next week.
Thanks again! your contributions to GG riders is invaluable!
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Old 05-20-2011, 11:31 AM
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Qui-gon Qui-gon is offline
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You still really need to pull the codes on the ecu you have. It will give some insight as to what went wrong. Did you try your ecu in your friends bike? Have you opened the ecu to see if there has been any moisture in there? The inside is open to the atmosphere via the black plug as that is how it measures atmospheric pressure. I would certainly explore all avenues before you shell out. If you have to buy new you might check out prices in europe. Depending on the exchange rate you may get a better deal. Last time I looked it was cheaper there.
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  #9  
Old 05-20-2011, 11:38 AM
BigChina BigChina is offline
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Hmmm....I did not put my ECU in my friends bike to verify...but I will do that tonight just to see what happens. I did pull the plug out (because I had no idea what that was for)...didn't see anything suspicious so I put it back in.
I don't have the equipment or the knowledge to pull codes off the ECU. I don't think anyone within an 8 hour radius of me knows how to either! Do you know of anywhere I might be able to send it to have it looked at?
Thanks!
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