|
Enduro Suspension Tuning & maintenance of Enduro forks, shocks, etc |
|
Thread Tools | Display Modes |
|
#1
|
||||
|
||||
KYB SSS Valving Input Please
I put a full 2008 YZ450 Front end on my 2000 GasGas XC300. I am 51yrs old, (riding 42 yrs). 6' 4", 250lbs in street clothes.*I enjoy all kinds of riding but prefer difficult single track, trails and hills.*(probably*B-C Enduro). *
* I changed springs to Racetech 48 with 5mm of preload.* I have tried to soften the forks about 7 times so far and below is what I have now for a tune. The forks are still too stiff on trail trash even with the compression adjusters complete loose. They work great for big hits but they are too stiff most for most all else. * Midvalve * Nut Washer 11mm*(x1) 0.25mm 12mm (x1) 0.11mm 14mm (x1) 0.11mm 16mm (x1) 0.11mm 18mm (x1) 0.11mm 13mm (x1) 0.11mm 20mm x0.045 (x3)* 0.11mm (Stock had 4) Piston 20mm x 0.045" (x2)*0.11mm (Stock had 4) 17mm x 0.045" (x2) 0.11mm (Stock had 3) 11mm x 0.01" (x2) 0.25mm 17mm x 0.01" (x3) 0.3mm 17mm x 0.045" (x1) 0.11mm (moved from above) Collar * Estimated Midvalve Float* 0.5mm (as I removed*two*0.11mm shims) * Base Valve * Nut Cup Washer 4 holes Spring big silver washer with collar Piston 32mm (x9) 0.11mm 20mm (x1) 0.11mm (from*midvalve stack) 32mm (x6) 0.11mm* (stock was 18x 32mm) 30mm (x1) 0.11mm 28mm (x1) 0.11mm 26mm (x1) 0.11mm 24mm (x1) 0.11mm 22mm (x1) 0.11mm 20mm (x1) 0.11mm 18mm (x1) 0.11mm 16mm (x1) 0.11mm 20mm (x2) 1.58mm 11mm (x2) 0.25mm * 310cc 5w BelRay oil * * It seems that the compression screws do not have a big impact on the dampening.* Any input would be appreciated. |
#2
|
||||
|
||||
I know sht about actual valving. I cheated and a mate revalved to KTech Club specs. Much betterer.
Opening to full open on the clickers can be more harsh as it blows through then gets stiff real quick. Best keep within several clicks of middle and find best comprise. Then revalve if that's not good enough. Any more clicks is out of range. Sorry can't give actual valving specs as I don't have them. But they can be made good for technical.
__________________
'07 EC300 GG '14 TXT250 GG '? 496 CPI Cheetah RZ/RGV hybrid '22 765 Street Triple RS '21 XTrainer '69 Stinger T125 Suzuki '23 TRS 250RR (it's a Trials thing) |
#3
|
||||
|
||||
Why all this lbs talk.. now I have to do conversions!
Being YZF450 forks, they'll probably have quite firm ICS rates. This adds quite a bit of firmness, especially when added with firmer preloaded springs as well. .5mm is quite a large float, and your mid very soft. I'd go back to around .4mm float, and a more traditional mid valve. Address the basevalve!! Piston 32mm (x9) 0.11mm 20mm (x1) 0.11mm (from*midvalve stack) --- I don't like crossovers this small. I'd be more around 26/28mm if using. 32mm (x6) 0.11mm* (stock was 18x 32mm) 30mm (x1) 0.11mm 28mm (x1) 0.11mm 26mm (x1) 0.11mm 24mm (x1) 0.11mm 22mm (x1) 0.11mm 20mm (x1) 0.11mm 18mm (x1) 0.11mm 16mm (x1) 0.11mm ----> this is your main issue. ----------add clamp 14mm x.3mm 20mm (x2) 1.58mm 11mm (x2) 0.25mm Simply changing the clamp to a 14/13mm shim x .3mm you'll soften the whole stack up. You may wish to pull a couple more face shims as well. Also, considering that you've upped spring rates, you may wish to add a bit more rebound control as well. |
#4
|
||||
|
||||
Note, just checked spring rates, and they should be fine. Even if you have the firmer ICS springs.
So I'd add another face shim back to both sides of the mid valve. That will close your float to approx .39mm. Then soften the basevalve to something like the following. 32 (6) 26 32 (6) 30 28 .. 14.3 (or 13) Then test. |
#5
|
||||
|
||||
Thank you both.
Jakobi -So to make sure I understand you correctly I should modify it like this? Midvalve * Nut Washer 11mm*(x1) 0.25mm 12mm (x1) 0.11mm 14mm (x1) 0.11mm 16mm (x1) 0.11mm 18mm (x1) 0.11mm 13mm (x1) 0.11mm 20mm x0.045 (x4)* 0.11mm (Stock had 4) Piston 20mm x 0.045" (x3)*0.11mm (Stock had 4) 17mm x 0.045" (x2) 0.11mm (Stock had 3) 11mm x 0.01" (x2) 0.25mm 17mm x 0.01" (x3) 0.3mm 17mm x 0.045" (x2) 0.11mm (moved from above) Collar * * Base Valve * Nut Cup Washer 4 holes Spring big silver washer with collar Piston 32mm (x6) 0.11mm 26mm or 28mm (x1) 0.11mm (I will see if I can find one in a set of WP43s) 32mm (x6) 0.11mm* (stock was 18x 32mm) 30mm (x1) 0.11mm 28mm (x1) 0.11mm 26mm (x1) 0.11mm 24mm (x1) 0.11mm 22mm (x1) 0.11mm 20mm (x1) 0.11mm 18mm (x1) 0.11mm 16mm (x1) 0.11mm 14mm or 13mm (x1) 0.3mm [U](I will see if I can find one in a set of WP43s) Do I remove both 20mm and the 11mm or do I keep the 11mm? Thank you for the help! |
#6
|
||||
|
||||
The shims below the main stack are referred to as the bleed stack. By running as below they don't block any ports off, which isn't needed for off road so I'd keep them as is:
20mm (x2) 1.58mm 11mm (x2) 0.25mm Have a look at the assembly and where they sit and you'll see what I mean. Everything above looks pretty good. |
#7
|
|||
|
|||
Quote:
I have a 2018 with the AOS forks and changed the ICS springs. Stock in them are 2.1 and on advice from a couple different timers I went all the way down to a 1.0. I too freaked a little about the pre-load but a quick call to race tech eased my mind. They said that a little pre-load is actually a good thing and stated it wouldn’t hurt a thing. The springs made a huge difference but a little valving work is still needed. I think the stack needs softened and probably go back up a few rates on the ICS springs. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk |
#8
|
||||
|
||||
The Marzocchi PFP forks run a load of preload on the ICS spring, and then the PFP allows you to wind on even more.
I prefer the stock ones with a little free play. It's not an issue that the damper rod doesn't extend all the way back on it's own. You can still pull it out the last bit by hand and it should extend smooth with damping. Once installed you still have the outer spring keeping it at full extension. Allows the first bit of travel to cavitate a bit and then the pressure ramps up. I don't think this is a bad thing for a trail setup. End of the day it's just another variable. |
#9
|
||||
|
||||
Thank you for the input. I took it for a quick spin and it feels better but I still need to go for a few more rides before I put it away for the year.
|
#10
|
|||
|
|||
I finally got my forks close to working how I believe they should.
Shims were 6x 32x0.1 22 6x 32 ->16x0.1 14x0.3 14x0.3 Flipped bleed stack After reading how you got on with the 12mm clamp I looked at my stack and had a 14x0.1 and 11x0.3 in my bleed stack so I swapped a few things around and ended up with. 6x32x0.1 22 6x 32 -> 16x0.1 14x0.1 11x0.3 14x0.3 Flipped Bleed stack So effectively now have an 11mm clamp, coupled with 0.48 springs and raising forks through the clamps 10mm (lowered front) it finally feels better than the sticky marzocchi 45s they replaced. My thoughts, i think my 06/07 YZ250f forks are a bit longer than the marzocchis. This was putting my weight back and slackening head angle, making the forks less active/harsh and leaving the front vague. Would like a little more small bump/trail trash compliance. Was out at a place recently, quite rocky all 2nd, 3rd gear tight tracks (no jumps), didn't use the last 3" of travel. Reb/Mid stock but 0.3 float in 1 leg and 0.4 in the other. Tempted to try 0.4 float in both legs and depending on how that goes maybe play with the ICS spring. |
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Thread Starter | Forum | Replies | Last Post |
05 shiver valving | jasont1532 | Enduro Suspension | 6 | 11-11-2012 10:40 AM |
Sachs fork valving '10 300 | Bailey28 | Enduro Suspension | 16 | 10-18-2011 08:43 PM |
sachs fork valving | dh racing | Enduro Suspension | 6 | 03-24-2011 01:03 AM |
08 EC300 Fork valving | AdrenalineJunky | Enduro Suspension | 9 | 08-13-2010 03:58 AM |