Rieju & GasGas Legacy Riders Club Forum  

Go Back   Rieju & GasGas Legacy Riders Club Forum > GasGas Enduro Technical Forums > Enduro Product Reviews

Enduro Product Reviews Feedback & Comments on Products Tested


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #11  
Old 10-15-2012, 10:32 AM
Corey Corey is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Laramie WY
Posts: 215
Default

Ok Folks, I realize money is tight, but lets put a few things in perspective.

1) You will not find a cheaper or easier 10%+ gain in HP (actually 14% on a 2012 GasGas 300 on GasGas's own dyno). People pay a lot more than $700 for porting work that leaves their cylinder irreparable and still won't make those types of performance gains. And the list goes on...pipes, reeds, carb kits etc. even combined a lot of times those mods won't afford you those type of gains and cost more.
2) Depending on riding habits a 30% gain in fuel economy will more than offset your initial costs of the SmartCarb and will soon pay for itself at the pump.
3) The SmartCarb can be removed and reinstalled on your new steed.
4) Performance gains, fuel economy gains and an emissions reduction, I challenge you to name one other product that can do the same thing. And I think you will quickly find that $775.00 is a bargain.
Nevertheless it is our goal to make them available to the masses on a wide scale so we are working to make them cheaper while retaining quality to more satisfy all parties and follow the scope of our vision. However to make a call on the value of the SmartCarb is a little premature don't you think? I look at it like the difference between a Rolex and a Timex; they both will tell the time but only one is a value added product that is worth more than the sum of it's parts.


Reply With Quote


  #12  
Old 10-15-2012, 02:46 PM
Corey Corey is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Laramie WY
Posts: 215
Default

No we get it. Any hope to supply to manufacturers will require production die cast bodies, my only point is that there is intrinsic value to this fuel system and it's all too easy to misinterpret its worth because of an unclear understanding of what it is.

We are working on several ways to increase awareness of the SmartCarb's benefits. Last weekend we equipped Jim Ryan's (Utah Dual Sport) 2011 EC 300 GasGas with a 38mm SmartCarb and rode it throughout the weekend during the pro endurocross invite only trails benefit ride. You'll see about it in Dec or Jan Dirt Rider Magazine. Anyway you could go ride Jim's rental and get a feel for how smooth and tangible the benefits really are once you ride with one. EVERYBODY that rides one swears it makes them a better rider. Just sayin...

Anyway here's a tease of the die cast bodies coming, I don't think you will be disappointed.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 40 Cast Assembly Tri-Vortex SMARTCARB w-o Orbit.jpg (69.9 KB, 233 views)
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 10-15-2012, 05:54 PM
Corey Corey is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Laramie WY
Posts: 215
Default

Phil, its all about the signal to the metering rod: The thing to remember is a caburetor is a passive device and can only respond as well as the engine it’s attached to; in terms of airflow and overall efficiencies. The shape of theSmatCarb’s venturi does an outstanding job of communicating mass airflow to the metering rod, insomuch that the caburetor becomes fairly indifferent to the metering rod (more specifically the size of the aperature at the needle/nozzle interface), and only shows problems if it is way too lean. I think Glenn stated earlier in this forum that what he thought it sounded like “is that you can go a lot richer and still have efficient atomization” and he is correct, you can run the carburetor very rich and still have decent performance. An interesting side note is conversely if the metering rod is too lean it simply won’t run hard enough past idle settings to hurt the engine, eliminating burned pistons. You don’t have any intermediate circuits to cheat it long enough to run through to the point of overheating the piston.

We do have different sizes and series of metering rods. Most changes are usually related to displacement of the engine only and have little to do with engine modifications. We typically use only one metering rod, from full mods to totally stock and have excellent results.

The ideal way to change the “preferred characteristics” with a SmartCarb is venturi size. For riders who like a milder hit with a lot of top end we recommend a 40mm for 250-300cc’s, for those who like a lot of torque and a little less top end a 36mm is recommended and for those who like both we offer a taper bore 40/38mm and 38/36mm.

Corey

2011 GasGas EC300

Last edited by Corey; 10-23-2012 at 08:27 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 10-15-2012, 05:57 PM
Corey Corey is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Laramie WY
Posts: 215
Default

Nambo, best case for die cast sales will be early spring 2013 and will be announced, with pricing, on APT's website: http://powerapt.com

Thanks for the interest,

Corey
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 10-15-2012, 08:48 PM
Corey Corey is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Laramie WY
Posts: 215
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nick View Post
What about 4stroke
We have several prototype models in the field right now, one won Pikes Peak on a Honda TRX Modified Quad this year, the other is on Marco Belli's TM powered Zaeta 530 racing in Italy throughout the fall. 40-44mm push pull cable TPS models coming late summer 2013, with other size models following. These are designed to replace the Keihin FCR.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 10-15-2012, 08:55 PM
Corey Corey is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Laramie WY
Posts: 215
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave View Post
When (not if ) I turn my bike upside down on some hillside - where does the fuel go considering this carb has no vents/overflows?
Right now it drains the float bowl straight into your engine if you leave it upside down long enough New models each vent tube has a one way check valve (ball).

Good question,

Corey
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 10-15-2012, 09:44 PM
GMP's Avatar
GMP GMP is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Jefferson Twp., NJ
Posts: 7,597
Default

Sometimes the small mfgs like GG have trouble getting Keihin carbs on time for production runs as they just don't order the numbers that the big five do. Now with Beta and Sherco coming out with new 2strokes, perhaps this is an OEM opportunity.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 10-16-2012, 08:13 AM
Corey Corey is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Laramie WY
Posts: 215
Default

Glenn you're on it. Clay Stuckey will tell you they actually hired someone to source off the shelf Keihin PWK's just to satisfy last years North American production. Dani Quintana told me that they can't get their orders in ahead of KTM and the reason Gassers come with a 38mm instead of the preferred 36mm that comes on most of KTM's two strokes.

I'm sure the tsunami/flood didn't help but the general consensus is that no one wants to work with the Japanese. And yes the time is ripe for an OEM application, actually all OEM's. This is the reason we have been testing with GasGas and if it hadn't been for their airbox issues last year and Spain's overall economic woes you would be seeing production Gassers equipped with the SmartCarb. It's not as easy as it sounds though and many things are in play. I will say one last thing though it will be all about who can meet emissions in the most cost effective way that will be the primary player.

Corey
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 10-16-2012, 08:22 AM
Corey Corey is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Laramie WY
Posts: 215
Default

Yes, they would work very well for you. I have Wobbly trying a set on a 400 twin GP bike in New Zealand right now. Should have a report by the end of the week. I will post his results here.

Corey

2011 GasGas EC300
2009 KTM XC300
2006 Yam WR450R
1997 Kaw KLR600 -
1991 KTM D-XC250
1989 Yam YZ250 -
1979 Can-Am TNT250 -
1978 Kaw KE125 -
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 10-16-2012, 08:39 AM
GMP's Avatar
GMP GMP is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Jefferson Twp., NJ
Posts: 7,597
Default

Corey,

I suspected as much, my new bike came with an older 38mm and notched slide and gave me fits jetting it. I'm not so against the 38mm on a 250, I have an '07 bike that just runs perfect with one. My '12 runs a hair softer off the bottom but revs to the moon, I suspect that is some porting variation as all else is the same. What has been the Smartcarb size of choice from GG testing? Is the taper bore a vertical taper, like some other "keyhole" bores?
Reply With Quote
Reply



Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
APT SmartCarb siaknijustin Enduro Product Announcements 19 10-02-2012 08:12 AM




All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:54 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2009 - GasGasRider.org