2011 ec300 kick start issue

[bigtoe]

Hi, I have a 2011 ec300 which is really hard to start with the kick start when cold, I can kick hard and fast 20 times and it won't fire, but when I give the electric start a push she starts after about three or four attempts, then I turn it off and try the kick start again and nothing ! touch the electric start and away she goes ! wtf ! and when I'm trying to kick it, about every 5th kick it back fires in the exhaust, this does'nt happen with the electric leg, does anyone know what is going on .
ps. I'm only using choke, no throttle

[Jakobi]

What are you jetting specs, and what is your kicking technique?

[Elvis74]

never heard problems like this.
Jetting spec would be interesting and have you checked your reeds?

[bigtoe]

Hi, I'm not sure what the jets are at the moment , we were having problems with the bike running to rich so we contacted a gasgas dealer in sydney who has done a lot of research and testing on this model and they sent me some new jets and needle which we installed and the bike is running a lot better much crisper through the rev range, but we still had this problem with original jets.
as for my kicking style I just do it the same as I always done and never had this problem before with the 20 or so bikes I've owned except for one wr250 which did exactly the same thing, I'm kicking it over faster than the starter motor is so buggered if I know whats going on .

[Neil E.]

My guess is that your jetting is off. The estart does a better job because the engine turns more than with the kicker. This extra rotation will get you past a questionable carb setup.

I'd say that maybe your slide is high and the choke circuit is only just able to overcome this.

[Jakobi]

I'm guessing the blokes at SMW would have hooked you up with an N3EH needle, clip 2, 40-42 pilot and 178 main. One thing they may not have asked you is.. What sized carb came on your 2011? Have a look on the cap and you'll see a number within a circle (either 38/36). If its a 36 it means the specs they gave you will be off a bit.

Also, as Neil said, bring the slide down a bit to ensure good signal while starting. The slide raised too high is a sign of still being too rich. You should be able to peak down the air boot and see the slide. It only needs to be 1-2mm raised.

Kicking technique I have the best success with is the old school Yamaha YZ/WR procedure. I generally turn the engine over a few times slowly just to ensure all is well and distriibute a bit of oil in the crank cases. Then push the kicker through until it builds resistance. This is top dead center (TDC). Release the kicker back up, take up the slack and then give it a full clean firm kick.

[Jakobi]

PS. Did you just buy this bike? Second hand.. ?

[bigtoe]

I bought the bike 2nd hand about 9 months ago, its done this since I've had it, even with the old jets, it's ok when hot, you say to adjust the slide , I'm no mechanic so how do you do this, I know how to adjust needle clip position, I looked all over the carb and couldn't see any numbers,I sa it's just the standard one that came with the 2011 models, also another thing ,I can only get it to idle very low, barely going, or when I try to give it a tiny adjustment it idles to high, then I back it off just fractionally and its drops back to barely running again, nothing in between ?.

[Jakobi]

The number is cast into the cap. Its hard to see but it is there. The 2011 models; some came with 36mm carbs, others with 38s.

Float height - Needs to be correct
Slide height - Determined by the idle screw

My experiences have been similar in regards to the idle that its only a little turn between an idle thats a bit too high and an engine that won't idle for long. Mine drops into a nice steady low idle for about 30 seconds. It will idle for longer in neutral once up to temp.

[bigtoe]

hi back again, I was talking to the local bike shop about this and he said he had a honda in the shop a while ago that did the same thing, and another customer saw them trying to start it hard and fast with no success, and told them to try kicking slowly, bizarre !! but then it started , they tried this a few more times and it started every time , so when I got home I tried this on the gasser, it was cold but on the fourth kick bingo ! she fired up, who would've known.