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Enduro Engine - 2 stroke Cylinder, Piston, Tranny, Bearings, Clutch, Pipes & Silencers, etc.


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  #21  
Old 05-05-2016, 08:14 PM
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Jakobi Jakobi is offline
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As above. Grab a pen and index your throttle grip against the body. You need to methodically work through the circuits.

Starting rich is the safest option, especially if you're concerned of being lean. Do some reading in the jetting threads and see what needles are suggested. You need to consider the year of the bike, the model of carb, your fuel, temp, elevation, and humidity. They all make a difference. Also be aware that the circuits overlap, and as such the main and particular needle need to be matched. Some needles offer more fuel towards WOT than others. Some provide more fuel off idle. You can have straight taper needles, dual taper, or triple tapers.

No one can give you a magic setup. Starting points, YES! but the tuning needs to be done by someone on the bike, using it in the way it intends to be used (there can be variables in what a particular rider requires too).

I have no experience with the older generation bikes, so can't really comment. The LTR needle was part of Les Tinius' (http://www.lt-racing.com/) kit. I don't think it's offered anymore but was a rebranded (possibly modified) straight taper needle. Some searching may show some results.

In regards to your question, in reality you should be able to tune the bike below 1/2 throttle quite easily even with the main jet not installed. At a 180 you may get some blubbering at WOT, but it's much easier to step the mains down as the final process. Work on getting the needle and clip position right. Then lean off the pilot circuit. Then the main. Finally, work in the area of the slide cutaway, needle diameter, and pilot to really fine tune the off idle and small throttle response if you're picky in those regards. Many aren't that particular.


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  #22  
Old 05-05-2016, 08:43 PM
GGRider01 GGRider01 is offline
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Throw the 180 in. Throw in a BR8 plug - and only use the BR8. That BR9 is colder than a BR8 and it is pointless. Do this and you could most likely just ride it like that from here to next Christmas. Or you can keep worrying "What if" and never get to enjoy it.

(deleted a lot of stuff)

Quote:
What should I do if I switch to the 180 and it has some running problems like bogging/spluttering?
You can do 2 different things. Lower the needle or go down a size on the main jet. Easy peasy.
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  #23  
Old 05-05-2016, 11:14 PM
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barossi73 barossi73 is offline
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Once youve made a couple of changes(1 at a time)and 'felt' the results you will find it gets easier.then you can tailor it to suit you.when comparing others jetting be sure you have the same carb and equivalent conditions(as above).PWKas1 has a screw lid type,PWKas2 has 2 philip screws in a rectangular cap.
Its useful to stick with same fuel ratio and oil type when making jetting changes.changing oils can color the plug differently.changing fuel ratio alters mixture.ie 40:1 is slightly leaner on petrol,and slightly richer in oil than 50:1.
Mix to the oil manufacturers recommendations
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  #24  
Old 05-07-2016, 01:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GGRider01 View Post
Throw the 180 in. Throw in a BR8 plug - and only use the BR8. That BR9 is colder than a BR8 and it is pointless. Do this and you could most likely just ride it like that from here to next Christmas. Or you can keep worrying "What if" and never get to enjoy it.

(deleted a lot of stuff)



You can do 2 different things. Lower the needle or go down a size on the main jet. Easy peasy.
I put in a 180 main and a BR8 plug and no luck, the low down power is there but it's struggling when it wants to hit powerband it hesitates(bogs/splutters) then hits the powerband but I don't feel like it's hitting as hard as it should.
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  #25  
Old 05-07-2016, 01:33 PM
GGRider01 GGRider01 is offline
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Bogging is lean, sputtering is rich. It's gotta be only one. I'm going to assume you're rich so drop the needle first, to #2 clip (2nd from top).

General consensus is to drop needle first. When you run out of adjustment on the needle then change the main jet. If #2 doesn't work, put it in #1. If that doesn't work, then drop the main jet and start back in #3 clip position on the needle.

Just curious, how long did you run it for?
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  #26  
Old 05-07-2016, 02:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GGRider01 View Post
Bogging is lean, sputtering is rich. It's gotta be only one. I'm going to assume you're rich so drop the needle first, to #2 clip (2nd from top).

General consensus is to drop needle first. When you run out of adjustment on the needle then change the main jet. If #2 doesn't work, put it in #1. If that doesn't work, then drop the main jet and start back in #3 clip position on the needle.

Just curious, how long did you run it for?
I put the #180 in and BR8 plug, warmed it up for around 3-5 minutes and then had a 5~ minute ride that was mostly 3rd/4th gear high RPM as the powerband is what I was mainly focused on.

The plug came out a nice tanish colour but I would say more white than tan which was making me think it was lean? I thought rich would make the plug a bit more black/brown but I don't know much.

I am also using it tomorrow for much longer where I plan to play about a bit more. Is it possible it could be my throttle needle? I notice I am using a needle that a lot of people couldn't get a long with, don't want to mess about with everything if I am just running a crappy needle.
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  #27  
Old 05-07-2016, 02:37 PM
GGRider01 GGRider01 is offline
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Sounds like you're close! Run that N1EF in the #2 slot. If it solves the sputtering and you're still white on the plug, go up to a 182 or 185.

The N1EF can work fine. Mine came with an N1ED (just as awful) and ran respectably. I made it a lot worse in the process of finding a much better needle. At 4600ft I had to run it as low as possible.

Just keep in mind jetting is one of those things you can't really do for someone without being there and having hands on but I reckon we get good enough. I just suggest running it for 15+ minutes next time before making a diagnosis. It will (or should) always sputtering for the first 5 or so minutes.
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  #28  
Old 05-07-2016, 02:42 PM
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Originally Posted by GGRider01 View Post
Sounds like you're close! Run that N1EF in the #2 slot. If it solves the sputtering and you're still white on the plug, go up to a 182 or 185.

The N1EF can work fine. Mine came with an N1ED (just as awful) and ran respectably. I made it a lot worse in the process of finding a much better needle. At 4600ft I had to run it as low as possible.

Just keep in mind jetting is one of those things you can't really do for someone without being there and having hands on but I reckon we get good enough. I just suggest running it for 15+ minutes next time before making a diagnosis. It will (or should) always sputtering for the first 5 or so minutes.
Thanks your help is really useful to me. I will run the bike for 1 lap (40 minutes or so) and then see how it is, if the bike is still having problems I will go up to the 2nd slot and try that on the needle.

If it is on the 2nd slot and still splutters whats the next step? Do I go up once more? I won't have any jets except 172, 178, 180 tomorrow so changing jets are out of the question unfortunately.
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  #29  
Old 05-07-2016, 02:45 PM
GGRider01 GGRider01 is offline
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Sounds like that's the only option you have.

For future reference, bogging sounds like holding the throttle wide open with the kill switch pressed in. If you're hearing that, you're kind of in the danger zone of leanness.
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  #30  
Old 05-07-2016, 03:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GGRider01 View Post
Sounds like that's the only option you have.

For future reference, bogging sounds like holding the throttle wide open with the kill switch pressed in. If you're hearing that, you're kind of in the danger zone of leanness.
It's really difficult to explain over forums as you can probably imagine but the power feels perfect right up to around 3/4 throttle I would say and then it hesitates/nothing/lack of fuel(?) then the powerband will kick in after 3 seconds or so.

I have searhed YouTube to try and find someone with a problem similar to mine so I can atleast give you an example of the sound but I can't find anything exactly like mine however I have found a cr250 with some really bad problems.
Link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w41yYn0_WI4
At the 20 second mark you can see it's building up power really well (mine is the same) then at around the 24 second mark it has a slight noise where it isn't hitting the powerband, where his continues to make this horrible noise and never hit the powerband mine will then hit the powerband a second or 2 later.

Hopefully that is easier to understand.
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