Opinion of Changes to US GG line for 2012

[Clay]

Originally Posted by twowheels

Love the "base XC "/ "Race XC" plans. Nambotin pricing is stratospheric, and despite his incredible riding skills for the majority of American riders Nambotin is just some foreign dude they've never seen race - drop it but keep the parts available.

Here's the golden nugget - an electric start 200 with a heavy flywheel, 9-10 inches of travel and shorter brake pedal and shifter, along with either adjustable levers or levers sized for smaller hands. The e-start could be removed to save weight and reduce flywheel effect, the suspension could be opened up to full travel, and the controls could be swapped out for "full size" if the need arose (or the rider grew).

It can cost as much (or nearly so) as a base XC but will open up the brand to kids/wives/girlfriends/gentlemen of smaller stature that are not being served with honest-to-goodness dirt bikes. There are lots of potential riders who are forced onto a) bikes too big, b) bikes too small, or c) lousy, overweight, old-tech bikes (eg. TTR250, CRF230) due to the lack of legitimate alternatives.

My 0.03 - it's Christmas after all

Steve,
Now I'm going to put you on the spot in front of the world.....! If we had this 200, it would have to cost more than the current 200 because it would have e start so lets say $7599. Keep in mind that the current GG 200 should retail for the same price as the 250 since it is based on that bike but we take a super slim margin to compete with the orange 200. How many would you order?
Clay

[dank]

Originally Posted by Clay

Dank,
I plan to ask for a 150....don't know if they will do it or not.
Clay

fantastic. the only other thing i would ask for is a smaller framed 100ish cc bike to compete with the kx100 and the ktm105. but thats just wishful thinking.

[GMP]

Clay is right, thats just too much coin for an entry level targeted bike. You could build your own starting with a nice used 200 for a fraction of that if you really want one bad enough.

My wife rides an '02 Pampera, perfect for her. Kick is a bit stiff but it starts in half a boot.

[ScottyR]

Back in 06, GG made the EC200 HOBBY which was a stripped down EC200 with 10-11" of suspension travel. Those bikes were welded to the floors at most shops and were discontinued after 1 yr. I know of one shop in Canada that still has a 2006 EC200 Hobby on the floor.

Redesigning the Pampera would be a better route IMO.

[Clay]

Originally Posted by GMP

Clay is right, thats just too much coin for an entry level targeted bike. You could build your own starting with a nice used 200 for a fraction of that if you really want one bad enough.

My wife rides an '02 Pampera, perfect for her. Kick is a bit stiff but it starts in half a boot.

More than once the Japanese have tried to build entry level sport bikes or cruisers at lower prices and failed. The entry level guy would rather have a two year old used bike as his entry level unit. Cheaper entry level units hurt the used bike market. The used bike market needs to be strong so that it doesn't cost too much for a seasoned buyer to get a new current model or for dealers to take a used bike on trade.
Hey Scotty....see those first three words from GMP?

[ScottyR]

Hey Scotty....see those first three words from GMP?

Thats something you dont see too often. Someone better mark the time and date down.

Its like Haileys Comet. You only see it every 76 years.

[Clay]

Originally Posted by ScottyR

Thats something you dont see too often. Someone better mark the time and date down.

Its like Haileys Comet. You only see it every 76 years.

LOL!!! You're on it today, aren't you?
You must have had more than those two beers!

[ScottyR]

About 3 more beers before the good material starts coming out...

[twowheels]

Originally Posted by Clay

Steve,
Now I'm going to put you on the spot in front of the world.....! If we had this 200, it would have to cost more than the current 200 because it would have e start so lets say $7599. Keep in mind that the current GG 200 should retail for the same price as the 250 since it is based on that bike but we take a super slim margin to compete with the orange 200. How many would you order?
Clay

On the issue of cost, its perfectly reasonable to expect the price to be as high as a 250, or even a 300 for that matter - you're just filling a bigger hole with a bigger plug, all else being equal. Or maybe the 200 should be built off the 125 platform ... but that's a 150 and you've already plowed that ground. Like everybody else I'd like to see a few hand raisers before I placed an order for a full container, but I'm not talking about a de-contented, old-tech bike, I'm talking about something white space built off an existing product.

There are lots of guys in the 5'7" range that are shortening suspension (most less than satisfactorily), and a bunch of guys buying Yamaha WRs and KTM 250Fs just to get electric start, only to end up with a tall, heavy, slow, electric-started bike. And yes I rode the GasGas 250F - better, but still a little 4 stroke.

Suppose you leave the electric start off but advertise the heck out of the option - then you've got an easy to ride two-stroke that fits those smaller in stature and addresses a market right from the dealer's floor that nobody else touches. Its way better than trying to add flywheel weights and gearing down 125 MXers and cutting fork springs, its lighter and way more satisfying than the 4-strokes, and and and ... The incremental cost for the bits at the factory is negligible, but currently adds ~$500 (suspension lowering, levers, shifter, brake) or more to do afterward. Price it like a real bike (because it is) but one that fits a different rider. Surely some riders evaluate what works for them as a first priority instead of shopping purely on price - if not we're all doomed to riding Chinese bikes.

[Clay]

Originally Posted by twowheels

On the issue of cost, its perfectly reasonable to expect the price to be as high as a 250, or even a 300 for that matter - you're just filling a bigger hole with a bigger plug, all else being equal. Or maybe the 200 should be built off the 125 platform ... but that's a 150 and you've already plowed that ground. Like everybody else I'd like to see a few hand raisers before I placed an order for a full container, but I'm not talking about a de-contented, old-tech bike, I'm talking about something white space built off an existing product.

There are lots of guys in the 5'7" range that are shortening suspension (most less than satisfactorily), and a bunch of guys buying Yamaha WRs and KTM 250Fs just to get electric start, only to end up with a tall, heavy, slow, electric-started bike. And yes I rode the GasGas 250F - better, but still a little 4 stroke.

Suppose you leave the electric start off but advertise the heck out of the option - then you've got an easy to ride two-stroke that fits those smaller in stature and addresses a market right from the dealer's floor that nobody else touches. Its way better than trying to add flywheel weights and gearing down 125 MXers and cutting fork springs, its lighter and way more satisfying than the 4-strokes, and and and ... The incremental cost for the bits at the factory is negligible, but currently adds ~$500 (suspension lowering, levers, shifter, brake) or more to do afterward. Price it like a real bike (because it is) but one that fits a different rider. Surely some riders evaluate what works for them as a first priority instead of shopping purely on price - if not we're all doomed to riding Chinese bikes.

Steve,
The problem here though is that you want to see a few hand raisers before you commit but I have to commit to the factory before I can take orders from you. In other words, if I commit to the factory for 200 units (the minimum they need to build a new unit, even if it is based off of an existing unit) and you and the the other 54 dealers we have order 2 each, then I will carry over nearly 100 units. See my dilema here?
Clay