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Old 04-11-2012, 03:34 PM
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Default KTM and Bajaj

At what point does a European Company become an Asian Company?
This is from Motocross Action website:

Bajaj, India's second-largest motorcycle manufacturer, has bought another 6.3% of KTM, according to the Economic Times. That gives Baja a little over 47% of KTM stock. It was an open market transaction, which means that Bajaj bought the shares from the key stake holders.

KTM president Stefan Pierer and Rudolf Knuenz hold more than a 51% stake in the company. Rajiv Bajaj said, ?We do not want to be the majority stakeholder as to convey the perception of exclusivity and premiumness." Even as the market for motorcycles in Europe and USA shrank by 5%, KTM successfully managed to increase sales by 13.4%. In 2011 KTM produced 81,200 bikes. Bajaj made 11,000 out of 81,000 bikes that KTM sold in 2011. During the first two months of 2012, KTM edged past BMW as the largest selling brand in Europe.

Not intending this as criticism of either company. Simply a discussion point about your perception of European and Asian motorcycle companies.
Clay


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Old 04-11-2012, 04:08 PM
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Bajaj made 11,000 out of 81,000 bikes that KTM sold in 2011.

In my eyes, that makes it still a pretty strong European brand.

You have to give KTM credit if they've displaced BMW from being the largest selling brand in Europe. They're doing something right.

If the Chinese collectively own 51% of GM stock, but have no strong presence on its board of directors, does that make GM an Asian company? Whether a company is Asian, European, or U.S. really depends on the management of that company, and how it is run. Harley Davidson has high foreign content, but to many, nothing is more "American" than H-D.
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Old 04-11-2012, 04:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blitz11 View Post
Bajaj made 11,000 out of 81,000 bikes that KTM sold in 2011.

In my eyes, that makes it still a pretty strong European brand.

You have to give KTM credit if they've displaced BMW from being the largest selling brand in Europe. They're doing something right.

If the Chinese collectively own 51% of GM stock, but have no strong presence on its board of directors, does that make GM an Asian company? Whether a company is Asian, European, or U.S. really depends on the management of that company, and how it is run. Harley Davidson has high foreign content, but to many, nothing is more "American" than H-D.
Those are all good points. Ownership prolly doesn't matter as much as location of production and the quality of the product and the orange company definitely produces a quality product.
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Old 04-11-2012, 04:52 PM
Mazikeen Mazikeen is offline
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Being in the automotive industry for 27 years I've seen alot, I no longer even consider manufacturers in this fashion. I do understand the consumers perception of this, however, it is now a world economy and parts are sourced and assembled, machines are just not built anymore, merely assembled and often with parts that are sourced even from a manufacturers competition, as that component is built at a better price point by a company owned by another company that markets itself as whatever the genius marketing group knows will attract the American consumer.

marketing will always convince people to buy this or that but the point of origin is becoming more and more irrelevant on a yearly basis and I see it becoming mute within a decade.

I appreciate the GasGas line and the KTM line personally because they took the evo template from the mid 80's and did it over "their" way, creating and useful combination of parts ending in a machine that is unique in its implementation of a common design and creating a "peronality". KTM has leveaged that IMO to become what it is, they have stayed ahead on the development side eclipsing IMO the "asian" manufacturers. If not for GasGas, I would certainly have chosen a KTM as the "jap" big 3 have no offering to competed on the segment of riding I enjoy.
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Old 04-12-2012, 08:18 PM
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Actually to make a comparison of KTM and BMW is kind of erie.. BMW is what every bike manufacture wanted to be.. the owners were on the bmw kool aide from birth and would never sway.. that is until BMW started building bikes in China.. The loyal BMW owners are taking this as if they were kicked squarely in the balls.. some have sold their prized antique bmw's(I have seen them sold and bought) and they have moved to KTM and trump and the like.. KTM is now on the same path.. when more production moves to india you will see less people stay with that brand.. no reason to pay top dollar for a bike that both the R&D and production is in india by people who do not have the passion.. They are on the BMW path.. and it will not be pretty.. Its not the same as cars being made everywhere.. most car buys only see the bottom line.. they do not drive the car cause they want to.. or race it.. its just a cage to most..
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Old 04-12-2012, 09:13 PM
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+1, I won't even consider Indian or Chinese bearings much less an entire motorcycle.
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Old 04-13-2012, 05:51 AM
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+1 . for the moment I think it's only the 125cc engine of the Duke. If they do the same for other engines they will have a tough time to keep the corporate identity in the long term.
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Old 04-13-2012, 06:02 AM
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With the Euro Zone financial crisis in general and Spanish economic situation specificallly..... I wouldn't be suprised if an Asian company, eventually becomes invovled with Gas Gas.
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Old 04-13-2012, 07:18 AM
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Quote:
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+1 . for the moment I think it's only the 125cc engine of the Duke. If they do the same for other engines they will have a tough time to keep the corporate identity in the long term.
My understanding from a friend who works at KTM is that the entire 125 Duke is made in India and then shipped to KTM where it is dyno and qc tested, then shipped to dealers.
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Old 04-13-2012, 07:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nhuskys View Post
With the Euro Zone financial crisis in general and Spanish economic situation specificallly..... I wouldn't be suprised if an Asian company, eventually becomes invovled with Gas Gas.
It is my understanding that the Spanish government puts a lot of pressure on the Spanish companies to use as many suppliers in Spain as possible.
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