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Enduro Engine - 2 stroke Cylinder, Piston, Tranny, Bearings, Clutch, Pipes & Silencers, etc.


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  #1  
Old 01-25-2013, 11:05 AM
Mc_Grath Mc_Grath is offline
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Default Problem with the steel clutch plates

I have an 2011 300ec. With 70 hours on the bike, the clutch started to work weird. When starting, it would be like an on/off switch and makin a light sound, so I opened it, when the clutch heated (and I mean the cluth, not the bike) it started to work better, almost right; but then again, when cooling down it started to work funny again. The basket had some little dents but nothing important, so I checked the steel disks and they were out bended of spects, if I put them over a glass, I could put a 0.4mm gauge under them. I changed them for the original steel plates and then it worked great, like a new bike.... until 5 more hours of use. Now the clutch is acting the same as before. Only 5 more hours and I suspect the plates are bend again. Any one have an idea about why they would bend? I did not change the friction plates but they seemed to be ok..

Thanks.
Bernardo.


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  #2  
Old 01-25-2013, 04:03 PM
jgas jgas is offline
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I used to have this problem with a KX 500 that I put steel plates in. If I rode it in really tight singletrack or technical terrain for long enough to severely overheat the trans and motor, the steel plates would warp and turn blue. On that big bike with all the power it had I had to really slip the clutch to help tame the power in technical terrain. This problem only happened in the worst clutch slipping areas and on rare occasions.

I would put them between 2 pieces of 2x12 wood and hammer them back as close as possible to straight. All of the plates would never be warped, only some, and some would be more warped than others. After getting them as straight as possible I would switch the position, use a different order. It would work until the next time I had to really slip the clutch alot for a long time. The clutch never stopped working but would get alternatively grabby then slip/grab off and on. Until I started using the steel plates the trans fluid would have noticeable aluminum particles in the fluid.

Finally after a couple years the stock clutch basket got so worn out I had to replace it with a billet basket. At that time I replaced the plates that were the most worn, and all the fiber plates which stopped the warping.

Later I learned that that particular bike's clutch needed a certain type of tranny fluid, or needed any good synthetic trans fluid with an additive to stay cool and not slip or grab. I got the info on the additive from the Kawasaki desert race team which was run by Roeseler at that time. I cannot remember the name of the additive but it sure worked. Even when hot the clutch would not be grabby or slip. I think I eventually ended up using synthetic automotive trans fluid from B&M with the additive. I think the additive was also an automotive racing product, but I can't remember who made it.

I'd do a search to find what is the most used trans fluid by users of this site. You'll get a zillion different answers and probably start some argument, but all you may need is a different type fluid. You will rarely go wrong using whatever the factory recommends, but sometimes you can find something even better. Keep in mind that what some factory racers use may not be best for you. The pros change fluid very often, and may not even have the stock clutch parts in their bike although they might not want to admit that
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Old 01-25-2013, 05:33 PM
Mc_Grath Mc_Grath is offline
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Actually that about using the clutch to tame the power happens to my. I ride very tight and extreme enduro so the clutch gets pretty hot. But when hot it works better than when cold... and that is weird. And that about not all disk bended is the same for me, I gonna try that about changing them in the position and try a different oil. For the record, I am using ATF dextron II for the clutch.

Thanks.
Bernardo
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  #4  
Old 01-25-2013, 08:32 PM
jgas jgas is offline
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It depends on who you talk to whether ATF is good for certain bikes. On older Kawasaki 2 strokes it was recommended even by the Kawi Baja race team. On Hondas it would make the clutch grabby and didn't work well at all.

I just called a long time GasGas guy I know who used to be a dealer and racer. He says not to use ATF in Gassers. Probably wouldn't hurt anything but it's not the best thing. He recommended Rotella 5w40 full synthetic or even better, Amsoil full synthetic. Again, on certain bikes, such as older Kawasakis, full synthetic oil would make the clutch slip and grab, but full synthetic ATF was fine. Every brand has it's differences. On a 92 Kawasaki KX 500 I used an automotive 10w40 synthetic motor oil one time when it was all I could get on a long distance ride at a small store, after I cracked a sidecase and lost my oil. It worked fine for about an hour then started slipping and grabbing. Later I changed it, but it still slipped. I had to take the clutch apart and clean the fiber and steel plates with contact cleaner and lightly sand all the plates to get that cheap synthetic oil off before the clutch would work right.

I only keep mentioning the Kawi and the differences in bikes to point out that if your bike has one brand of plates, it might make a difference? Who knows whether or not GasGas uses only one brand of fiber or steel plates in every bike? I have seen some bikes, (and cars), of the same type with different parts even though they were the same model and year. BMW used to use very different parts and fluids for the models sold in Germany than for those sold in the US. Germans tend to change fluids and replace parts on very strict schedules. Every BMW actually sold in Germany used to come with a SERVICE manual, not just an owners manual. And most German owners would actually stick to the recommended service schedules which were really far too conservative, wasteful in my opinion. On the other hand, most US owners go too far the other way and don't do service often enough.

I am using an automotive full synthetic with good results in my bike, but he recommended a lighter grade which I am changing tonite. When I run out of the brand I have I'm switching to Rotella. I know it works great in KTMs and Suzukis from long experience and it's mid-priced.
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Old 01-26-2013, 02:29 PM
Mc_Grath Mc_Grath is offline
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here in europe we don't have Shell Rotella. so I am going to try a other full synthetic 5w40 oil soon, and between all the steel plates I have, select the ones that are in a better form and see whats happens.
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